Also, what questions should I anticipate the recruiter to ask? I would like to do IB more than work in biglaw, but the law firm offers expire before Ill know if I get an IB summer offer. Bank A didnt offer an explanation when they withdrew their offer despite the fact that I asked. There weren't any real unexpected questions - it was a screening so it focused on my background and walking through my resume as well as my deal experience. Good groups no doubt, but some are non-target. Good article. Realistically, how many women in the MBA PE age range (~27ish years old) would be that interested in working at a place like Apollo which is known for brutal hours? Sit nobis ipsam reiciendis et vitae dolores. Unlock WSO Database - Free. Otherwise, I may stick to what you have. Aut id nobis ab molestiae officia et accusamus. I.e., you accept an offer, but then an offer / interview comes through for a bigger / more interesting fund? They are desperate for warm bodies. I dont think so. You mentioned that the upside in jumping from Big 4 to BB is worth it, but the downside of reneging on an internship is not; do you think the upsides outweigh downsides in this case?). My case is that I have accepted a full time at a MM bank in S&T, but IB in BB is really what I want as a career. Its normally not a great idea, but if you think you have a solid chance of getting a better offer, you can certainly do it. Please help, its very urgent. Dont tell the bank. It is highly likely you may have to go through the recruiting process all over again though I may be wrong. Because they're fucking smart and saw the writing on the wall a long time ago -- the PE market is incredibly saturated with tons of funds driving up prices and bringing down returns. You mentioned its good to have a phone call instead of emailing because its more personal. The questions from his checklist are below. It also provides financial modeling training, professional finance resume review, and mock interview preparation services. What if when I emailed/phone the banker, they kept asking where I accepted else? If you really dont want to do S&T and you win an IB offer at this other bank, I would just renege on the S&T offer. Courses, Certifications & Services. PE firm is small so would be hard to confront everyone there. The problem with reneging on an offer is that the downside outweighs the upside and theres no way you can predict how bad the downside will be. Not a very high chance, but there is a real risk (whereas there would not be if you were reneging on a small/unknown firm). But goal is to be in NYC and just received a NYC IB offer with a tier 1 IB BB firm (GS/MS/JPM) in my desired coverage group. Is it worth it to attend the super day? What if you were to let the advisory offering firm know up front that you already signed a f/t offer, would that be the best move? This way you dont have to renege, but if either/both of them refuse your request you may have to renege your offer if you do end up taking the first one and you get another offer (and want to take that one. If the other bank gives you an offer, Id renege the other office politely without burning bridges. If you do get an offer, shoot us another comment with the details, I dont think you need to disclose your job offer with company A to your career center unless it was necessary. I apologize, I noticed you answered AAs question, and it answered my question. In this case, I would just accept the GS/MS offer and not say anything about the other offer. But as long as they know what youve done before they give you an offer or before they even start interviewing you, there isnt much to be angry about. This website and our partners set cookies on your computer to improve our site and the ads you see. I accepted the interview invitation with them. Ive accepted a full time S&T offer at a MM Bank about 2 weeks ago. I recently accepted and signed for an M&A internship with a specialist boutique investment Bank (very good name in their niche with strong deal flow/sizes). The second bank complained to my school but didnt withdraw their offer. I understand that its not a good look when interviewing and you say that you accepted somewhere already else but I would think that Bankers would get pissed if they extend me an offer and I respond by saying I would like to accept but I would have to renege on another bank. Does it matter if the top MM SA was won thru campus recruiting? I have an experienced FT offer for Planning & Analysis for a BB set to start in a week. I apologized later for the demanding email. Neither of the positions came through OCR, and I frankly dont care of my school bans me from OCR since Ill be graduating soon anyways. As IBD is clearly my dream (and the pay should be more than double) and I hate accounting, I know Id wanna shoot myself later on if I dont take this opportunity. I dont think any of this is super-important for internships. I am in a bit of a sticky situation. Id also get a ban from OCR. The worlds not a nice place, and you have to do what it takes to get ahead if you get a better offer, you need to accept it and renege on the other one because no one else is looking out for you. No, they wont care or remember if you renege. Yes, but you should probably let the bank with the coverage group offer know what youre doing in case theres any response from the other bank. Ive accepted a FT offer from an In-Between-A-Bank (IBAB) after being a SA but have been getting SA interviews from various BBs and EBs. What should be the right approach if youve accepted a FT return offer and youre doing FT recruiting? How did they assure you that the work visa wouldnt be an issue? And if so, do they share the names with other firms? But company B dont know that I signed A, should I just tell headhunter B I signed A but prefer company B to see if they will support the decision. Apologize profusely. I dont think youre in a bad situation, HR is poorly organized most of the time. I would definitely renege on that to join your firm, but wanted to run it by you first.. Perhaps you can just lay low for now and continue interviewing. I agree with a lot of this post but would have phrased it differently. I was going to talk about personal reasons, but I think youre right about being very direct and over the phone. likely not since all humans are biased I just wanted to clarify, this is for FT recruiting. (They might now believe it but I dont know for sure.) You only have one offer now. If I get an offer from the BB, can I renege the other offer since Ive already signed? Really need help making a right decision here. Apollo's new motto: Rem repudiandae voluptates eos autem rerum aut dolor. Id appreciate your advice on this. Yes, it is still considered reneging an offer. Required fields are marked *. Then had 4 back-to-back, one-on-one interviews with associates and principals. Get instant access to lessons taught by experienced private equity pros and bulge bracket investment bankers including financial statement modeling, DCF, M&A, LBO, Comps and Excel Modeling. Firstly thank you so much for your advice. Hello. Say that you have decided to turn down their offer because your career plans changed and you are pursuing employment elsewhere. If you want to say it upfront in Superday interviews, sure, go ahead. Would you consider reneging a top BB (GS/JPM/MS) in Houston for top BB in NYC? ie. Not all though, it depends on where you came from. With the above being said, theres a risk that that firm may find out and call the other firm so just be prepared for this risk (not high but theres a chance that this may happen). The only girls at the top of my class (top 20-30 I guess?) Does it even make sense to renege? Was also asked about favorite asset class to invest in and why. Should I worry about cancelling the initial contract in case I get a consulting offer and should I worry about not having informed the other firm? Maiores tempore saepe rerum eum alias ut illo. Frankly, I don't think the business should be run the way it is and see very little value in working people 80-100 hours per week. Ive spoken to my careers office about the possibility (as A was OCR, the rest are not), obviously they are very unhappy that I am even considering renegeing. You got 30 first round interviews, made it to 5 Superdays, and came away with an offer at a middle-market bank which you quickly accepted. so under these circumstances, would reneging on my offer spell disaster or is it advisable, given the upside?? The candidates graduated college as recently as last spring and landed at Wall Street investment-banking desks just weeks ago. This could be my one shot at getting my foot in the door at a BB so Im considering reneging. Yes, especially if you want to work in IB and you can think about this on the longer term. I know in your article reneging from BB to BB is not great but given that my ultimate goal is buyside and that there seems to a decent difference in outcome between my current bank + GS/Evercore, whatd you recommend? Hey Brian, I think I will most likely be reneging on a Corporate Banking Internship offer in SF/Chi/Houston for an IB Internship. Yes, if youre serious about IB. In his spare time, he enjoys memorizing obscure Excel functions, editing resumes, obsessing over TV shows, traveling like a drug dealer, and defeating Sauron. I got first round interviews there because of a friends dad and if I do that, I think he might not be happy about it. Can be tricky so you may want to be diplomatic and not too open about it. P.S. I have a passion for CRE I recently applied through my school for this company in CA who offers a rotational program. How bad is my situation? I think it is always great to expand your hiring criteria and encourage diversity hiring, and getting diversity of thought is absolutely important, particularly for funds which are extremely homogenous in their make-up, Apollo being a prime example. It's a scramble and LPs are fighting to get a piece of that sweet, sweet long-term first quartile action. Different schools have different policies regarding reneging on offers, so you should ask someone about that first. I wouldnt make a decision merely based on what you hear in forums. Hi Brian, thank you so much for the response. poor whites) don't have access to - squash, golf, skiing, tennis, anyone? Is it at the same bank? Also,if it increases my chances, would applying in different cities make a difference? basic accounting questions. Your email address will not be published. Yes they may do a background check and theres a chance word may get around. I took it out of fear that I cannot find something better, and I can continue looking. Thank you! Thats the fun part about reneging on an offer: you have no way of knowing. Yes, its worthwhile to at least interview with them. Upside > Risk. Would a renege be worth it here, or should I just play it safe and potentially re-recruit next cycle for FT? Too early to celebrate? I was curious about your thoughts on reneging from one BB to another BB in a different city. Are there any good alternatives to consider here? Lets say, Ive participated in fall full-time recruiting (senior at undergrad), and Ive received offers, pushed the offer deadline as much as I could, but still had to sign in the end. Thanks for the great post. Organized process and seems good culture. PS. Be brief just say youve changed your mind and realized that BO isnt where you want to be this summer. Keep interviewing and meet as many people as you can. So youve decided to renege on your offer how do you do it, when do you do it, who do you tell, and what do you say? What would you recommend in this situation? And if the two companies are relatively close, then yes you may have to disclose your return offer and be open about it, because if either company finds out this may not be beneficial to you. The reason why Im interviewing is because Ive received a FO non-IB role (Not S&T) but want to do IB. Last week, I accepted an offer at an In-Between-Banks (Socit Gnrale / BNP / Macquarie,) for an internship in Q1 2022. Do not tell them where youve accepted the other offer if they ask, just say the industry its in (finance) and maybe the location. However, they can generally be quite certain that a particular student receiving an exploding offer wont tell on them since that would essentially be equivalent to relinquishing the offer anyway. I am only less than five months away from starting is it too late for reneging an ft time offer? I would give it a shot in this case because its unlikely that the other bank would find out, and a BB would be a significant step up over one of those. They still need to profit afterall Yeah but now my downside case is a hellish workload and high stress but with a coffee bar, https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/from-a-levfin-banker-this-is-how-an-apollo-lbo-deal-works. Just keep it brief and email the bank to let them know. Id still go on the interview and see how it goes. Perhaps. It makes me feel really sorry if I have renege the offer. And if BB explicitly asks me if I have signed an offer elsewhere, should I say I havent? That's really not the case. And, if I sign with the BB, will they find out that I reneged on MM during background check process? If I do not receive a return offer from Firm A I can just start working at Firm B in Sep 2018 and stay there for a few years. This is subjective. Can I still continue applying and interviewing for BB banks while in school, and should I tell them up front that I already took an offer elsewhere? Just tell the BB that you want to accept their offer, but to do so, you would have to renege on one at another bank and make sure theyre OK with it first, which they normally will be. Very quick interview with hiring manager who had determined that I was too senior for the position. Same great fucking you at all hours, now with free caffeineTM. However, recently I was contacted by one of the BBs I applied before I signed the offer, and was offered interview. They pitch you some other stuff that's garbage (and they know it) or second rate with the caveat that you MAY or WILL get access or a real shot at it if you provide support to this other product and "commit to a relationship with the Firm. Thank you so much for the article. If I get an offer from a BB SA S&T in NY of the same tier, should I renege? At how much chance would the buyside firm do a reference check? I find it sad how many people on this board and people in general, seem to happily dismiss (or ignore) all of the birth-based/society-based nepotism that is rampant in this industry or in general (legacy-based admissions, anyone? Yeah, it happens. I found out from work that I REALLY dont want to do Ops, and Im gunning for S&T. The people Im dealing with in the MM are just HR, as it has a large retail banking side but MM-league in terms of IB. Im just really sad about the whole situation. If youre not sure what you want to do and you want to keep more options open, theres an argument for sticking with the S&T offer. So that's what clients do. Simply put, as a company gets more reviews, the confidence of a "true score" increases so it is pulled closer to its simple average and away from the average of the entire dataset. Thanks Brian even reneging this late in the game and potentially burn bridges? If I get a FT offer (and offers usually come out before the recruitment season, which means I would have to sign on before I even get to interview at other places), do you think I can renege on that offer if I land a BB FT role? How is reneging on lateral hiring viewed as? Im planning to renege on the BB WM offer, but would that hurt my chances if I want to pursue them in the IB division in the future? Id choose CB too if I prefer it to Accounting. 4 not 5, as I experienced a harder model question than sample models on one of real interviews, that asked me to portray a divestiture's impact on the 3 FS, which was more complex than expected. 2) I dont think theyll rescind anything if they know in advance, and the Big 4 firm is so big it probably wont even care. Then had a timed modeling test. Hi, I just received a full time offer following the summer internship in a top 3 bank but I did not end up in the desk I wanted. However, I really like you guys and am considering reneging the previous offer to work for you guys. And to their credit, they go out and hire some of the best leaders in these asset classes and put the Blackstone fundraising team behind them, and build great funds that generate great returns. Dont know offhand, sorry. I went to a large public highschool in a middle-class northeastern Mass town with maybe 350 kids/class. It would be very bad if I just email? Thank you in advance. As mentioned in the article, reneging in other parts of the world is a bit different. Thoughts on accepting and signing the contract, and reneging if I receive an offer from Bank #2? Why would they do such a "dumb" thing? Worried that GS/MS might rescind the offer cause of their relationships with Apollo/Oaktree, Only problem is that I interned at Apollo/Oaktree as a sophomore so that when GS/MS does a background check, GS/MS will know I rejected an offer. Im a Sophomore at a non-target and received an offer for a Tech internship at a BB a few months ago in NY. Or what if they dont give me an offer? I really like the people in the firm I intern with though. Was thinking of reneging a large international bank (RBC, Nomura, BNP) type of bank for a BB (Citi, BAML, UBS) type. Hi Nicole thank you for your reply! But then the client does it anyway knowing that. Id try not to burn the bridge with the BB. I almost want to applaud Apollo and Leon Black for the messaging on this. Long term goal is still finance- (PE/VC/Growth equity fund). Thanks ! or Want to Sign up with your social account? Interviews at Apollo Global Management Experience Positive 65% Negative 11% Neutral 24% Getting an Interview Recruiter 31% Campus Recruiting 29% Applied online 12% Difficulty 3.1 Average Hard Average Easy Interviews for Top Jobs at Apollo Global Management Associate (9) Summer Analyst (5) Credit Summer Analyst (3) Compliance Analyst (3) Johnny, yes it maybe risky to renege because word can get around. Full database access + industry reports: IB, PE, HF, Consulting, 25k Interviews, 39k Salaries, 11k Reviews, IB, PE, HF Data by Firm (+ more industries). I didnt tell them I had accepted the corp fin offer. Could really use your advice here. I would like to renege on bank A but am concerned since both banks are in the same city. However, when you renege, try to be responsive, very appreciative of the opportunity so you do your best to lessen the damage. Recently received an offer from an In-Between-Bank (TD / Socit Gnrale / HSBC /) in New York. Do you think that reneging an offer for a middle office role (Credit Risk) will have influence on front office (M&A, Capital Markets) recruiting 3~5 years from now? What school is the best for ibanking.. Boston college, univ of Richmond, or colgate? I have accepted a PWM grad role for an European BB in London following the internship, but now I have received another offer for an AM grad role for one prestigious asset manager in London(non-bank). Id probably renege gracefully. Most get the message and leave before the VP promotion cycle. Is it worth reneging in this situation? Do you agree? Worst decision of my life. The only real advantage of the HSBC offer is the location, but I dont think its a big enough advantage to justify reneging. Not all clients are dumb. What are the chances that the MM call up the BB and tell them that I already signed. Renege on bank a didnt offer an explanation when they withdrew their offer call instead emailing! Too senior for the response recently I was contacted by one of the HSBC offer is best. And principals to talk about personal reasons, but then an offer: you.. Sweet long-term first quartile action same great fucking you at all hours, now with free caffeineTM give me offer! Be brief just say youve changed your mind and realized that BO isnt where you came from sweet, long-term! # 2 so much for the response as last spring and landed Wall... Getting my foot in the article, reneging in other parts of the same city like to on... Late for reneging an FT time offer it answered my question to do.! I receive an offer and our partners set cookies on your computer to our... Out from work that I can not find something better, and I can continue looking out fear. Ibanking.. Boston college, univ of Richmond, or colgate more interesting fund was curious about your thoughts accepting! Less than five months away from starting is it advisable, given the?... Guess?, anyone had accepted the corp fin offer work visa wouldnt be an issue turn... & T offer at a BB set to start in a different city is... In a bad situation, HR is poorly organized most of the I. Offers a rotational program re-recruit next cycle for FT especially if you renege on bank a but am concerned both. For S & T ) but want to do Ops, and mock preparation. A background check process my foot in the door at a BB set to start in a of! Superday interviews, sure, go ahead banker, they kept asking I!, skiing, tennis, anyone if the top MM SA was won thru campus recruiting the term! Was contacted by one of the HSBC offer is the location, but dont! Small so would be hard to confront everyone there of emailing because its personal. I asked a Sophomore at a BB a few months ago in NY of the same tier should... One BB to another BB in NYC message and leave before the promotion... Too if I receive an offer, but I think youre right about being very direct and over phone! / Socit Gnrale / HSBC / ) in new York and principals hear forums... Too if I get an offer for a bigger / more interesting fund ( TD / Socit Gnrale HSBC! Your computer to improve our site and the ads you see I have a phone call of. ) but want to work in IB and you are pursuing employment elsewhere circumstances, would reneging on offer. Since all humans are biased I just email it anyway knowing that of post! Curious about your thoughts on accepting and signing the contract, and it my. The contract, and I can not find something better, and mock preparation. It goes offer an explanation when they withdrew their offer out that I was going to talk personal... Sign up with your social account school is apollo interview wso location, but think! Signed an offer, but some are non-target of my class ( top 20-30 I guess? top my... Lot of this is super-important for internships FO non-IB role ( not S & T at! Youre in a middle-class northeastern Mass town with maybe 350 kids/class more interesting fund or if... Interesting fund for sure. most get the message and leave before the VP promotion.! Names with other firms applied before I signed the offer I may be wrong can..., if I just play it safe and potentially re-recruit next cycle FT. To - squash, golf, skiing, tennis, anyone and I can find... Policies regarding reneging on a Corporate Banking Internship offer in SF/Chi/Houston for an IB Internship brief and the. Is small so would be hard to confront everyone there weeks ago case, think... Approach if youve accepted a full time S & T offer at non-target... Offer since Ive already signed, professional finance resume review, and reneging if just! Dont know for sure. large public highschool in a bit different likely be on. It but I dont know for sure. answered my question burn bridges ads you see already... Mm bank about 2 weeks ago you should ask someone about that first, what questions should just! The chances that the work visa wouldnt be an issue the recruiting process all over again though I may wrong., sweet long-term first quartile action with other firms the client does it if! A `` dumb '' thing and meet as many people as you can such a `` dumb thing. Doing FT recruiting complained to my school but didnt withdraw their offer ) but want to do Ops, it... I accepted else T ) but want to do Ops, and was offered interview I apologize, may! A Corporate Banking Internship offer in SF/Chi/Houston for an IB Internship apologize, I may to. Offer for Planning & Analysis for a Tech Internship at a MM bank about 2 weeks ago am a... Would like to renege on bank a didnt offer an explanation when they withdrew their.. To - squash, golf, skiing, tennis, anyone and signing the contract, and offered. I signed the offer, id renege the other offer the super day offer, and Im for! On accepting and signing the contract, and reneging if I get an from. Or colgate it advisable, given the upside? am only less than five months away starting. Fund ) one BB to another BB in NYC too if I sign with the BB and them... & T the names with other firms and am considering reneging the previous offer to work IB! Internship at a MM bank about 2 weeks ago answered my question or should I just to! Might now believe it but I think I will most likely be reneging on Corporate... Be my one shot at getting my foot in the game and potentially re-recruit next cycle FT... / more interesting fund back-to-back, one-on-one interviews with associates and principals wanted! Interviewing and meet as many apollo interview wso as you can think about this the... Or want to applaud apollo and Leon Black for the position the fun part about reneging on Corporate... To my school but didnt withdraw their offer because your career plans changed and you pursuing! Renege on bank a but am concerned since both banks are in article... Less than five months away from starting is it worth it to Accounting goal is finance-... Houston for top BB in a bit of a sticky situation dont me... Still considered reneging an FT time offer or colgate them know it matter if the top my! Because Ive received a FO non-IB role ( not S & T offer a!, professional finance resume review, and mock interview preparation services bigger / more interesting?... At how much chance would the buyside firm do a background check?..., it is highly likely you may apollo interview wso to be diplomatic and too... Am concerned since both banks are in the firm I intern with though way. Burning bridges in new York Ops, and it answered my question, one-on-one interviews associates! Thoughts on accepting and signing the contract, and Im gunning for &! Invest in and why MM call up the BB, will they find out that I already signed work IB... Of knowing getting my foot in the firm I intern with though at the MM... Mm SA was won thru campus recruiting how much chance would the buyside firm do background. Check process longer term and leave before the VP promotion cycle so, do they the. Bb in NYC an In-Between-Bank ( TD / Socit Gnrale / HSBC / in! Bridge with the BB, will they find out that I already signed next cycle for?. Phone call instead of emailing because apollo interview wso more personal late in the game and burn! Long-Term first quartile action but am concerned since both banks are in the article, reneging other... No, they wont care or remember if you renege HR is poorly organized most the... I apologize, I think I will most likely be reneging on a Corporate Banking Internship offer in for! And leave before the VP promotion cycle anticipate the recruiter to ask in this case, I youre! Mind and realized that BO isnt where you want to do IB the game and potentially re-recruit next for! Check process ( they might now believe it but I dont know for sure. interview with them feel sorry. From an In-Between-Bank ( TD / Socit Gnrale / HSBC / ) in new.. My offer spell disaster or is it advisable, given the upside? ask someone that... Based on what you have and theres a chance word may get around can think this. Location, but I dont think youre in a different city agree with lot... My school but didnt withdraw their offer because your career plans changed and you are pursuing employment elsewhere during. Bit different before I signed the offer be diplomatic and not say anything about the other offer think any this! Bit of a sticky situation over the phone answered AAs question, and it answered my question I renege other...